Chevy Colorado & GMC Canyon banner
  • Hey Everyone! Enter your ride HERE to be a part of this months Ride of the Month Challenge!

41 - 52 of 52 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,552 Posts
Honestly, if the average family could get along well with only one income, that would be ideal. That's the "good old days" politicians love to refer to back in the 1950s/1960s, so if a family can get by with one income and one parent can stay home (in a "nuclear" family), then that certainly won't hurt anything.

Now whether the people at the top with 25M+ quarterly bonuses want to share a little down the line without something tragic eventually happening we'll have to see. I suspect it would take politicians that actually work for the people to do so (no, we don't really have any of those right now), but they could have a more fair tax/wage system. It exists in Europe, and I don't think any of the countries it's in have gone bankrupt or full communist China.
The tax situation is tricky for sure. My son sold a business that he worked very hard on with 80 hour weeks for a very long time, and sacrificed a lot for. It was a good sale but not enough that he can retire young. Because it was incorporated in a state with income tax, he paid about 50% of the sale price in combined state and federal taxes. I don't know what is fair.
 

·
Registered
2021 ZR2
Joined
·
67 Posts
So why do they quit?? Work is too demanding? They want to make a living just not doing anything? They lost the concept of how you have to work for money? If that is the case, the world is over.
That's the million dollar question. We do work 6 days a week most weeks, It is hot in summer time. but in eastern Kentucky getting paid almost $17.00/hr to sit on ya butt and put felt on bearing seals and pair them is pretty good change. If your on CNC machine your in the $21-25/hr range. But yet we cannot get people. Last month it was told we needed to hire 25 to staff for uptick in sales. Think we have already gone thru 25 people.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
357 Posts
The tax situation is tricky for sure. My son sold a business that he worked very hard on with 80 hour weeks for a very long time, and sacrificed a lot for. It was a good sale but not enough that he can retire young. Because it was incorporated in a state with income tax, he paid about 50% of the sale price in combined state and federal taxes. I don't know what is fair.
I'm not so much referring to people who started their own business. That's a different issue. I'm referring to the "next in line" CEOs who are in a company that they had nothing to do with the success of other than being a caretaker after it's already up and running.

Say a current CEO at Verizon, or Mary Barra, or something like that. She didn't start GM, she's a caretaker who got to her position because she knew the right people and made the right friends along the way of her career with people who could help her continue to rise on the corporate ladder. I guarantee you there are 100 (maybe 1000) people in GM who could do the job better than she does, but will never have the opportunity because they weren't in the "right" clique.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 404 Not Found

·
Registered
Joined
·
275 Posts
People don't want to work or don't Have TO WORK?
This. Not sure why some push a narrative everyone under the age of 30 apparently wants to just sit at home.

Covid changed a lot of things, and not merely because of some stimmy checks.
-Women left the workforce in large numbers to stay home and take care of the kids. Some due to necessity, some due to the financial equation, and some just having a rethinking of life priorities and trading off less household income for more time with kids that don't stay young very long.
- Retirees left a lot of service jobs. No need to debate Covid but at it's onset the data was pretty damning for mortality of the over ~55. Retirees working part time gigs for 20-30k per year decided it wasn't worth rolling the dice. Our schools can't find bus drivers anymore. Before '20, almost all were the grey haired set. Perfect retiree job, couple hours in the morning, couple in the afternoon, middling pay. Now its mostly either 20-somethings, or, sorry to say, some people that really aren't able to get decent jobs (have had a few questionable characters including a quite unstable 30-something woman who saw no issue with daily yellings at elementary school kids should they dare have a conversation during a 30 minute bus ride)
-A lot of people left crappy low paying service jobs because there's a shortage of labor, and labor has leverage right now. There's only one group of people who will work hard manual labor for ~10 bucks an hour, and certain folks think they're public enemy #1...
-A lot of millenials/zoomers have embraced the online social media economy in different forms. You or I may not like the fact some pics on a website older folks might think was just for selling cooling fans can generate a few thousand per month, but hate the game not the players.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
275 Posts
I'm not so much referring to people who started their own business. That's a different issue. I'm referring to the "next in line" CEOs who are in a company that they had nothing to do with the success of other than being a caretaker after it's already up and running.

Say a current CEO at Verizon, or Mary Barra, or something like that. She didn't start GM, she's a caretaker who got to her position because she knew the right people and made the right friends along the way of her career with people who could help her continue to rise on the corporate ladder. I guarantee you there are 100 (maybe 1000) people in GM who could do the job better than she does, but will never have the opportunity because they weren't in the "right" clique.
To be fair there were about a dozen people before her who did a worse job. Lets face it, GM had been on a downward slide since the early 70s when they had 50% market share, and only a massive government backed reorganization 13 years ago that allowed them to shed a lot of dead weight not otherwise possible, kept them from extinction. Barra has them more profitable then they've been in 50 years. The bet their making on EVs, we won't know for about 20 if it paid off and was the right move.

I've been in corporate management for 15 years, you're not going to reach a high level executive position simply by knowing the right people and making the right friends. You still have to prove and distinguish yourself, at least in most corporations that aren't majority controlled by a family or specific group entity (like Ford).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
357 Posts
I've been in corporate management for 15 years, you're not going to reach a high level executive position simply by knowing the right people and making the right friends.
Sounds exactly like what someone would say to justify why they're in the position they are.

You may have been much better than the other people competing for your same job when they hired you for it, or you just may have had the right "look", "history", "friends", or "recommendation". I've seen plenty of it from both sides of the coin (below management and in management) to say that about half of getting to executive management is talent related and half is exactly what I said. You'll find people there for both reasons, but you won't ever make the corner office if you don't have the "right friends in the right places". It's always about who you know just as much as if not more than what you know.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
357 Posts
Oh and I wasn't trying to pick on Mary herself. GM has been in trouble for decades, at least back to Roger Smith if not before. Mary was just a name that most people on here would be familiar with so I used her as an example. If I tried to pick the current CEO of say, Kelloggs (who I have no idea who that is without looking it up), it's likely no one would know who I was referring to.
 
  • Like
Reactions: NHRATA01

·
Registered
Joined
·
275 Posts
Sounds exactly like what someone would say to justify why they're in the position they are.

You may have been much better than the other people competing for your same job when they hired you for it, or you just may have had the right "look", "history", "friends", or "recommendation". I've seen plenty of it from both sides of the coin (below management and in management) to say that about half of getting to executive management is talent related and half is exactly what I said. You'll find people there for both reasons, but you won't ever make the corner office if you don't have the "right friends in the right places". It's always about who you know just as much as if not more than what you know.
CEO answers to the board of directors and indirectly the shareholders. You're not going to last long if you're incompetent, it doesn't matter who's friend you are. I don't disagree knowing people is what is going to open the doors of opportunity to higher levels of management, but once the door is open if you s**t the bed, you're still getting fired or put in the proverbial penalty box somewhere. There's certainly plenty of people who have peter principle'd themselves into middle management, but in a profitable, well run corporation you're not going to see it widespread in the c-suite. And Barra does not fit that description (EDIT - noted in your 2nd reply).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
357 Posts
But, at least now, they'll get a nice multi-million dollar golden parachute to go away because in a lot of cases they serve on each other's boards. That's what I have an issue with.
 
  • Like
Reactions: NHRATA01

·
Registered
2020 Z71 Midnight Edition w/ Urban Armor Equipment
Joined
·
153 Posts
Discussion Starter #50
Nah, you just didn't see it because people thought they "had" to take those jobs. They were still **** jobs with awful pay.

What's happened now is two things:
1. COVID broke people mentally. They've decided that they'd rather be poor than put up with some of the **** they've put up with for low pay before. Life is too short to work your ass off for no money, with no free time, and then get sick and die only to be replaced by the next cog in the machine. It's the same reason why no one (not even the R's) will "really" close the borders. We need people who are too desperate to fight back to do some jobs for the wages we "expect" to pay. Go check out a meat packing plant for example. They're all legal in there.....cough.
2. We outsourced everything to China in the last 20 years (thank you to every CEO and President/Congress for that btw). Now, with their lockdowns when one person sneezes, it's destroyed our ability to have the materials we need to make stuff here, or made the stuff itself unavailable because we not only don't have the materials, but the factory closed and moved to China in 2010. We've found out recently that one key material for critical equipment, which could be made here, is instead sourced for all 10 manufacturers from one company in China. WTF!!! It can be fixed, but someone will have to build a plant onshore and get it up and running. Hopefully we don't need new equipment for a couple years...

You want to fix it? Stop relying on China for everything from raw materials to manufacturing. Start making stuff here again. Will it suck and be expensive? Yes. But it's our only choice unless we want them to keep having us by the balls. God Forbid they invade Taiwan now.
This. So much this. I love it when people bitch and complain about everything being Chinese made but the last 60 years kept voting for the same ass clowns who made it nearimpossible to do business here. Remeber when a guy in the steel plant with a union job could make enough for a car, a house, and the wife could hang at home if she wanted to? I had a machine shop near me hiring CnC techs for a whopping $9.50. I laughed and stole two applicants and paid them almost triple that. Disclaimer: I despise unions and what they’ve become but I won’t deny they do make their members get good pay. Point is,DC wrecked the manufacturing base here due to asinine regulations, red tape and their idea of fair competition. Stuff made here is always quality but many times is because those employees are paid well and other reasons. People have gotten so use to cheap throwaway junk, they’ll scoff at a tool or appliance twice the price but will last a decade longer. It’s sad. I’ve always told people that globalization can be good for business but having one country who doesn’t like you make everything isn’t a good idea. If we get into a shooting war with our Chinese friends, people will learn real quick when China turns off the tap. They might realize that the 1,649 regulations protecting the cross eyed wombat likely weren’t worth it
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,643 Posts
CEO answers to the board of directors and indirectly the shareholders. ...
I wanted to pull that simple piece out of your comment: CEOs and Board answer to the shareholders. They have a fiduciary duty to the shareholders. Not the employees, not the consumers. They need to maximize profits. So, oil companies take advantage of oil shortages to raise gas prices. Auto manufacturers choose to raise prices because they can. Auto manufacturers decide the market for CCLB and ECLB trucks is so small, they are better to ignore that market.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,552 Posts
I'm not so much referring to people who started their own business. That's a different issue. I'm referring to the "next in line" CEOs who are in a company that they had nothing to do with the success of other than being a caretaker after it's already up and running.

Say a current CEO at Verizon, or Mary Barra, or something like that. She didn't start GM, she's a caretaker who got to her position because she knew the right people and made the right friends along the way of her career with people who could help her continue to rise on the corporate ladder. I guarantee you there are 100 (maybe 1000) people in GM who could do the job better than she does, but will never have the opportunity because they weren't in the "right" clique.
The compensation and ultimate severance packages for high up company executives is something that gets me so riled up I try to ignore it to reduce my stress level LOL. Yes, many work very hard, but the level of their compensation relative to the median pay of all their employees is obscene.

What helps maintain it is the incestuous relationship on the boards and committees that determine salaries combined with their inflated egos and distorted views of their self worth. It is disgusting. This costs everyone who is a shareholder directly or indirectly which means most of the middle class population.

This is bad for employee morale, and bad for adding legitimate ammunition to the left on capitalism gone bad.

Back OT my insurance company listed as one reason for rate increases, the necessity to provide longer term rental cars to policy holders waiting for parts to repair their primary vehicle.
 
41 - 52 of 52 Posts
Top