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Yes, and GM provided a fix.
Only about half of the cars have actually had the recall completed. But the question here is why would GM need to offer an incentive during a time when dealers have a hard time keeping ICV's on their lots? Maybe because consumer confidence hasn't been "fixed"...
 

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Discussion Starter · #82 ·
Only about half of the cars have actually had the recall completed. But the question here is why would GM need to offer an incentive during a time when dealers have a hard time keeping ICV's on their lots? Maybe because consumer confidence hasn't been "fixed"...
Possibly. I think there are 3, just as plausible reasons for this:

  1. Although some people will always look for a reason to distrust an organization/brand/federal agency, GM either has a Bolt image problem, or the perception of one.
  2. GM is releasing the Electric Equinox this next year and it would make no sense to have the Bolt and Equinox priced similarly since the Equinox is shaping up to be a much better EV riding on GMs Ultium platform.
  3. The Bolt might have had some cost calculated into it for the $7500 tax rebate which has since ended.


Regardless of the reason I 100% took advantage of it and bought a Bolt EUV.

I'm confident that LG fixed LG's fuckup, despite GM taking the blame. Either way it was destined to be parked and charged outside, so it doesn't really impact me.
 

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Discussion Starter · #83 ·

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Discussion Starter · #84 ·
Speaking of lifestyle changes, you are bound to forget to plug in once in a while and so you will inevitably wake up the next morning and be forced to drive your truck. The horror!

If you are anything like me, give it a few years and you'll get fed up with the EV. At least 20% of EV owners go back to ICV's anyways.
Oh the horrors of driving my truck ! haha.

It's possible. But my at-home gas station is awfully conveniently placed right where I disembark, which is right next to the charging port. This is why I think having an EV and ICE truck are a great combo. I can go an entire work week and hit the grocery store as well without charging my EUV though

Plant Automotive tire Road surface Brick Wood
 

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Discussion Starter · #85 ·
the bolt drive-train was supposed to have a crate option coming soon ive heard as well as the ford's. the battery pack was included, but i dont know how much that would run
I have to admit, I'm envious. Just switching back and forth between my dumb cruise control and the adaptive CC in my wife's i3 makes me long for a smarter car. Not quite ready to jump ship (even though I've been thinking about it), but self driving features is a big draw to me.

There are companies that have been doing EV conversions and selling kits for years.

That's really cool, I hadn't heard of that. Still need a ton more stuff for a conversion, but a crate motor from one of the big 3 is a great step forward.
GM has had an e-crate concept for a few years now. That one is also pretty lame lol



For anyone interested, not a unique picture, but here's what the motor in the trunk looks like. Also there's a deep dive youtube video of it disassembled and how it works. Not the most high tech thing in the world, but seems like a nice simple motor for a transportation appliance. 3 different coolant reservoirs (all use the same DEXCOOL), wiper fluid, and brake fluid. Orange denotes the high voltage cabling I believe.

Hood Vehicle Car Automotive design Personal luxury car
 

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For anyone interested, not a unique picture, but here's what the motor in the trunk looks like. Also there's a deep dive youtube video of it disassembled and how it works. Not the most high tech thing in the world, but seems like a nice simple motor for a transportation appliance. 3 different coolant reservoirs (all use the same DEXCOOL), wiper fluid, and brake fluid. Orange denotes the high voltage cabling I believe.

View attachment 429977
Weber has a great series on the Bolt drivetrain, I have watched them several times.

transportation appliance is the perfect description for a Bolt!
 

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Discussion Starter · #87 ·
Weber has a great series on the Bolt drivetrain, I have watched them several times.

transportation appliance is the perfect description for a Bolt!
Haha that is what I've taken to calling it. I enjoy using it like I enjoy using a good washing machine, and am about as emotionally attached to it as I am a good washing machine. Of course I take care of both of them to preserve them and keep them in good running order.

Coming up on 1 week and 500mi in the bolt. Have a few thoughts on daily usage I'll post up then.
 

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Like it or not:
  • ICV's will never go away for a myriad of reasons, the most significant being that the vast majority of electrical energy has been and will continue to be generated from internal combustion. Batteries simply are not nor will they ever be feasible for every vehicle application. Is there a happy middle ground somewhere? Yes. But to declare ICV's are going away is completely absurd.
    • Your 15 year timeline is also laughable at best. Most eastern countries and manufacturers that have signed onto EV mandates and agreements are pushing hybrids within 15 years...not full blown EV's, and even 100% hybrids is not a feasible goal within 15 years considering the global lack of resources and manufacturing capacity that would be required to accomplish that.
You can bury your head in the sand or wish upon a star as much as you want, but unless there is a major reversal in direction, other than a few niche vehicles like HD trucks you will not be buying new ICVs off car lots in less than 20 years. To be clear, I'm talking about new car dealerships, selling new cars in the US. ICVs being gasoline or diesel. For timeline, between 2035 and 2040. You know what CA, MA, NY and WA all have in common? They all passed laws banning new ICV sales by 2035 or sooner (heavy duty vehicles excepted). Several other states are pushing for a 2035 federal ban.

Personally I think it's all BS. It's going to be problematic and while I'm obviously an EV fan I think they should take over (or fail) based on merit and consumer demand, not government regulation. However, what I want is irrelevant. States are banning ICV sales and manufacturers are claiming to go EV only on a similar, and in many cases shorter, timeline.
  • Lithium ion batteries are chemically limited to approximately 1/40th the energy density of liquid hydrocarbon fuels such as gasoline or diesel. And despite the fact that most ICE's are typically limited to about 20-40% thermal efficiency they still have a roughly 10x advantage when it comes to usable energy storage. So it is not just unlikely that batteries will reach the energy density of a gas tank, it's literally impossible.
When speaking of an unknowable future I try to avoid terms like never or impossible, but as a general statement I agree. Current lithium ion tech is really only a stop-gap. Fine for phones and laptops and vape pens, but definitely not the long term future for EVs for a variety of reasons. Not as energy dense as a gas tank is somewhat irrelevant though.
  • Battery charging infrastructure will also never reach the practicality of a gas tank. Charging stations are far more complex and expensive than a gas station, and going back to the primary method of global electrical generation. Some type of hydrogen, magnesium, or synthetic fuel cells would be the only competitive solution for EV's in this category.
On this one I think you're being loony. Charging stations are far less complex and cheaper than a gas station. Restaurants put charging stations out front. Walmarts have charging stations. City parks, airports.. Oh, and I have a charging station in my garage. I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that you probably don't have a gas station in your garage. Maybe you have a farm? I know a lot of farms have large tanks for refilling equipment, but not very common for your typical neighborhood home.
  • Yes, the power companies actually are stupid because they are mostly controlled by stupid politicians. If they were smart, they would have been building nuclear power plants decades ago when the resources were more affordable and the political climate was more favorable.
  • On some level the most recent 'infrastructure' bill will only generate inflation and economic vulnerability because, big surprise, most of the funding doesn't even go to infrastructure projects...
This doesn't really touch what I was getting at, power companies are planning for and working toward being able to handle the inevitable increase in demand. I do agree with what you posted though.


I'm fed up with ICV's. This post has me looking at Bolt EUV's as something to tinker with. I can't imagine Silverado EV's are going to be cheap when they come out, probably fully loaded models and people willing to pay way over MSRP first. I don't play those games, so it will probably be a year/two after it releases before I seriously look at buying one. Bolts are on the ground right now and dealers have inventory. I'm just not that into small cars, but something Bolt-sized would really make sense right now.

I see GM is doing a $6k incentive on the Bolt/EUV. I'm curious (too lazy to look right now) what the breakdown looks like. MSRP - incentives - any applicable tax rebates. This would be a short (2? year) ownership for me so I'd strongly consider a lease, being my first EV and all.
Have you seen the better than Bolt alternatives (supposedly) coming out next year? I've been eyeing the Mach-e since they were first announced but it's just not quite there for me. Part of it is I don't like the interior. With the recent Equinox and Blazer announcements the Mach-e is off the table for me. Still in the prototype/vaporware phase, but what little they have shown for both interior and exterior are far better IMHO than the MME. We will see what they are like when actually available to buy, but at this point I'm interested.
 

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For anyone interested, not a unique picture, but here's what the motor in the trunk looks like. Also there's a deep dive youtube video of it disassembled and how it works. Not the most high tech thing in the world, but seems like a nice simple motor for a transportation appliance. 3 different coolant reservoirs (all use the same DEXCOOL), wiper fluid, and brake fluid. Orange denotes the high voltage cabling I believe.

View attachment 429977
Thanks for the pic - interesting.

Does it have a battery cooler (Summer use) and batter heater (Winter use) - to keep the battery in the optimum temp range for longevity?
 

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Discussion Starter · #90 ·
Thanks for the pic - interesting.

Does it have a battery cooler (Summer use) and batter heater (Winter use) - to keep the battery in the optimum temp range for longevity?
I believe it does. Battery conditioning is even one of the 3 "usage statistics" it displays. It has "active liquid battery management" which I believe either passes through the front radiator for cooling or uses the cars heating system. I can't see it being a winning battle to spool up the AC just to cool the battery, so I assume it goes through the radiator. But then that raises the question of when the car is static... Good question... Something I will definitely research.

The battery conditioning also changes its frequency depending on if it is plugged in or not, so it's recommended to leave it plugged in, if able during really hot or really cold days per the owners manual and forums.
 
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Discussion Starter · #91 ·
You can bury your head in the sand or wish upon a star as much as you want, but unless there is a major reversal in direction, other than a few niche vehicles like HD trucks you will not be buying new ICVs off car lots in less than 20 years. To be clear, I'm talking about new car dealerships, selling new cars in the US. ICVs being gasoline or diesel. For timeline, between 2035 and 2040. You know what CA, MA, NY and WA all have in common? They all passed laws banning new ICV sales by 2035 or sooner (heavy duty vehicles excepted). Several other states are pushing for a 2035 federal ban.

Personally I think it's all BS. It's going to be problematic and while I'm obviously an EV fan I think they should take over (or fail) based on merit and consumer demand, not government regulation. However, what I want is irrelevant. States are banning ICV sales and manufacturers are claiming to go EV only on a similar, and in many cases shorter, timeline.

When speaking of an unknowable future I try to avoid terms like never or impossible, but as a general statement I agree. Current lithium ion tech is really only a stop-gap. Fine for phones and laptops and vape pens, but definitely not the long term future for EVs for a variety of reasons. Not as energy dense as a gas tank is somewhat irrelevant though.

On this one I think you're being loony. Charging stations are far less complex and cheaper than a gas station. Restaurants put charging stations out front. Walmarts have charging stations. City parks, airports.. Oh, and I have a charging station in my garage. I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that you probably don't have a gas station in your garage. Maybe you have a farm? I know a lot of farms have large tanks for refilling equipment, but not very common for your typical neighborhood home.

This doesn't really touch what I was getting at, power companies are planning for and working toward being able to handle the inevitable increase in demand. I do agree with what you posted though.



Have you seen the better than Bolt alternatives (supposedly) coming out next year? I've been eyeing the Mach-e since they were first announced but it's just not quite there for me. Part of it is I don't like the interior. With the recent Equinox and Blazer announcements the Mach-e is off the table for me. Still in the prototype/vaporware phase, but what little they have shown for both interior and exterior are far better IMHO than the MME. We will see what they are like when actually available to buy, but at this point I'm interested.
Please respect my wishes from post #76 and stop debating mass adoption of EVs on this thread. There's tons of threads already filled with that.

As far as the MME, the price and software limitations were enough to dissuade me, and now the massive recall over their high voltage batteries disconnecting during acceleration, which then causes uncommanded acceleration or deceleration... no thanks. I'll take my Bolt and double check my fire insurance, but pretty sure LG fixed LG's fuckup with the new pouch cells.
 
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For anyone interested, not a unique picture, but here's what the motor in the trunk looks like. Also there's a deep dive youtube video of it disassembled and how it works. Not the most high tech thing in the world, but seems like a nice simple motor for a transportation appliance. 3 different coolant reservoirs (all use the same DEXCOOL), wiper fluid, and brake fluid. Orange denotes the high voltage cabling I believe.

View attachment 429977
fyi, if you want to add coolant. dont. or atleast use the correct stuff. it can only take GM dexcool 50/50. do not add water or concentrate. very bad things can happen if you dont.
 
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Have you seen the better than Bolt alternatives (supposedly) coming out next year? I've been eyeing the Mach-e since they were first announced but it's just not quite there for me. Part of it is I don't like the interior. With the recent Equinox and Blazer announcements the Mach-e is off the table for me. Still in the prototype/vaporware phase, but what little they have shown for both interior and exterior are far better IMHO than the MME. We will see what they are like when actually available to buy, but at this point I'm interested.
There are lots of very good EV's already on the market. I'd love a Mach-E, Polestar 2, even an id.4. They're nice cars with decent range. The Bolt is appealing based on price. It's good range for the money, but the tradeoff is it has the design and personality of a toaster. The above quote about it being an appliance is true. But I think it's a likeable one, a good little toaster :)


fyi, if you want to add coolant. dont. or atleast use the correct stuff. it can only take GM dexcool 50/50. do not add water or concentrate. very bad things can happen if you dont.
I'll bite. The Dexcool concentration in some of my ICE vehicles from GM, new, from the factory, isn't even 50/50. What happens if you add a little (pure) water or a little (concentrated) coolant to a roughly 50/50, but not always exactly, mix from the factory? Is this like jerk off too much and you'll go blind, or is there some real reasoning here?
 

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You can bury your head in the sand or wish upon a star as much as you want, but unless there is a major reversal in direction, other than a few niche vehicles like HD trucks you will not be buying new ICVs off car lots in less than 20 years. To be clear, I'm talking about new car dealerships, selling new cars in the US. ICVs being gasoline or diesel. For timeline, between 2035 and 2040. You know what CA, MA, NY and WA all have in common? They all passed laws banning new ICV sales by 2035 or sooner (heavy duty vehicles excepted). Several other states are pushing for a 2035 federal ban.

Personally I think it's all BS. It's going to be problematic and while I'm obviously an EV fan I think they should take over (or fail) based on merit and consumer demand, not government regulation. However, what I want is irrelevant. States are banning ICV sales and manufacturers are claiming to go EV only on a similar, and in many cases shorter, timeline.

When speaking of an unknowable future I try to avoid terms like never or impossible, but as a general statement I agree. Current lithium ion tech is really only a stop-gap. Fine for phones and laptops and vape pens, but definitely not the long term future for EVs for a variety of reasons. Not as energy dense as a gas tank is somewhat irrelevant though.

On this one I think you're being loony. Charging stations are far less complex and cheaper than a gas station. Restaurants put charging stations out front. Walmarts have charging stations. City parks, airports.. Oh, and I have a charging station in my garage. I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that you probably don't have a gas station in your garage. Maybe you have a farm? I know a lot of farms have large tanks for refilling equipment, but not very common for your typical neighborhood home.

This doesn't really touch what I was getting at, power companies are planning for and working toward being able to handle the inevitable increase in demand. I do agree with what you posted though.



Have you seen the better than Bolt alternatives (supposedly) coming out next year? I've been eyeing the Mach-e since they were first announced but it's just not quite there for me. Part of it is I don't like the interior. With the recent Equinox and Blazer announcements the Mach-e is off the table for me. Still in the prototype/vaporware phase, but what little they have shown for both interior and exterior are far better IMHO than the MME. We will see what they are like when actually available to buy, but at this point I'm interested.
I took this reply to somewhere it belongs:
 

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its the chemical make up of the fluid, sorta. there are alot of very little coolant passages in the battery, and if you add the wrong stuff, you can have some sort of deposits or something block the holes and cause the battery pack to potentially overheat and fail.

its possible that water that has ABSOLUTELY nothing in it will work, but as far as GM is concerned it a bad idea
 

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Discussion Starter · #97 ·
fyi, if you want to add coolant. dont. or atleast use the correct stuff. it can only take GM dexcool 50/50. do not add water or concentrate. very bad things can happen if you dont.
There are lots of very good EV's already on the market. I'd love a Mach-E, Polestar 2, even an id.4. They're nice cars with decent range. The Bolt is appealing based on price. It's good range for the money, but the tradeoff is it has the design and personality of a toaster. The above quote about it being an appliance is true. But I think it's a likeable one, a good little toaster :)




I'll bite. The Dexcool concentration in some of my ICE vehicles from GM, new, from the factory, isn't even 50/50. What happens if you add a little (pure) water or a little (concentrated) coolant to a roughly 50/50, but not always exactly, mix from the factory? Is this like jerk off too much and you'll go blind, or is there some real reasoning here?
its the chemical make up of the fluid, sorta. there are alot of very little coolant passages in the battery, and if you add the wrong stuff, you can have some sort of deposits or something block the holes and cause the battery pack to potentially overheat and fail.

its possible that water that has ABSOLUTELY nothing in it will work, but as far as GM is concerned it a bad idea

Interesting, thanks for the heads up. Usually I'll flush the system with distilled water and then add a predetermined concentrate equal to 50% of the coolant, but in 5yrs when the time comes to flush these coolant systems, I may just take it to the dealer since the service manual calls for vacuum fluid replacement...
 

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Discussion Starter · #98 ·

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Discussion Starter · #99 ·
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ARCowboy, you can still flush the system, kinda, and you can buy that coolant yourself and do it yourself, I think its really just standard Dexcool 50/50, so no real difference other than using "special pure" water that normal 50/50 uses, its only gonna cost more... concentrate is way cheaper but risky in the EVs. I just wanted you to know just in case.

Ive read the labels of the concentrate and the 50/50 at work they are the same just one comes with the i think distilled(?) water. Heck my parts guy wont give me 50/50 unless im using it on an ev. haha. so i have to do maths to top off coolant on cars yay.....
 
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